Starting stats for Wizards?

Post by b***@dogs-like-spam.com
I want to create a new high elf wizard. My first stop was the Casters
Realm character creation guide. They offered two main suggestions; an
INT-based approach (pour your 25 bonus points into INT) or a STA-based
approach (pour your 25 bonus points into STA). I've noticed the STA-
based approach being suggested in this newsgroup for classes such as
shaman. Does the STA-based approach make sense for INT-based casters
such as wizards?
I went to Magelo to see if I could determine the value of the STA-based
approach. Pouring 25 bonus points into STA didn't seem to pay off very
well; a level 10 wizard with 100 stamina only has someting like 10 health
more than a level 10 wizard with 75 stamina. At level 65, the difference
was 65 health (75 STA vs. 100 STA).
Unless the extra health from stamina starts scaling much better as STA
rises above 100, it seems like the STA-based approach isn't appropriate
for wizards. Especially since the depth of the wizard mana pool is
extremely important; for example, a wizard needs a deep mana pool to solo
well. If a wizard runs out of mana before the enemy is dead, the wizard
is dead.
Comments? Suggestions? Thanks. :-)

I made my wizard on the INT approach - I put 5 into STA to bring it to 80,
and everything else into INT. At 65 with full buffs, I buff out to 3600hp,
which with epic is enough to get a Concussion off if I get summoned on
anything but a raid mob. On a raid mob, if you get summoned you're doomed
anyway.

But by maxing out INT and manapool, I never run OOM except on raid mobs that
take a while - I can chain off nuke-nuke-concussion-nuke-nuke-concussion all
day long, never get summoned, and do VERY respectable damage. (Oh, how I
wish for Ornate pants...)

If I were to make a new wizard, I'd put 5 or 10 points into STR instead of
STA, and put the rest into INT. Why? Because while I don't have much of an
HP problem, and I have no serious mana problem - I often find myself
encumbered! Almost every bag I own has weight reduction, I still walk
around within 15 pounds of encumbered constantly.

Rhian DeDanaan,
65th Wizard
Xegony

Jazz

2003-12-17 18:00:13 UTC

Post by Archerbear

I made my wizard on the INT approach - I put 5 into STA to bring it to 80,
and everything else into INT.

Archerbear is right. Go with the INT and pump everything into it that
you are allowed to. Later on in life, your wizard will care about one
thing and one thing only... mana. It's your lifeblood. My sorcerer was
well past the 3K unbuffed mana pool level by the time he was sixty and
whether you are on a raid mob, or just soloing or in a group, there will
be times you want every drop of mana you can squeeze out.

Hit points can be very nice in your first ten to twenty levels before
wizards begin to come into their own, but that passes quickly. Later on
in life, HP aren't going to matter to you. You're not going to be the
one taking a beating from big mobs, and if you are, it will be
mercifully short beating.

Then you go loot your corpse after your rez. ;-)

Go with the mana. This is your mantra.

--
jaZZ

-"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity,and I'm
not sure about the former. "
Albert Einstein (1879-1955)

KinSlayer[2040]

2003-12-17 22:53:03 UTC

Post by Jazz

Post by Archerbear

I made my wizard on the INT approach - I put 5 into STA to bring it to 80,
and everything else into INT.

Archerbear is right. Go with the INT and pump everything into it that
you are allowed to. Later on in life, your wizard will care about one
thing and one thing only... mana. It's your lifeblood. My sorcerer was
well past the 3K unbuffed mana pool level by the time he was sixty and
whether you are on a raid mob, or just soloing or in a group, there will
be times you want every drop of mana you can squeeze out.
Hit points can be very nice in your first ten to twenty levels before
wizards begin to come into their own, but that passes quickly. Later on
in life, HP aren't going to matter to you. You're not going to be the
one taking a beating from big mobs, and if you are, it will be
mercifully short beating.
Then you go loot your corpse after your rez. ;-)
Go with the mana. This is your mantra.
--
jaZZ

Ill disagree here, putting your points into INT isnt the best in the long
run, Reason being that you will max out your INT long before you will max
out your sta as a wizard. Mana pool and HP are the most importent stats. you
can get to Max int from bazaar sold stuff. i went for max sta and my int
unbuffed is about 340. after all your mana pool wont do crap if your dead
from mob_001's nasty AE

Ben Sisson

2003-12-17 23:31:39 UTC

Post by KinSlayer[2040]
Ill disagree here, putting your points into INT isnt the best in the long
run, Reason being that you will max out your INT long before you will max
out your sta as a wizard. Mana pool and HP are the most importent stats. you
can get to Max int from bazaar sold stuff. i went for max sta and my int
unbuffed is about 340. after all your mana pool wont do crap if your dead
from mob_001's nasty AE

Said by someone who didn't have to level from scratch sans kei when
theres no real newbies to group with anymore.

Max int. Worry about high level stamina stuff when you actually get
there. You still have to get through the untwinked lowbie levels and
you'll need mana for that.

KinSlayer[2040]

2003-12-18 11:11:47 UTC

Said by someone who didn't have to level from scratch sans kei when
theres no real newbies to group with anymore.

Actually my first wizard was born a week after kunark came out there wasnt
any KEI then either for lowbies (or anyone) i belive i put all my points
into STR/int back then. my current wizard was STA then str this time

Post by Ben Sisson
Max int. Worry about high level stamina stuff when you actually get
there. You still have to get through the untwinked lowbie levels and
you'll need mana for that.

I was saying that even if you dont put a single point into INT you can max
your int at level one REALLY cheaply these days.
who said the original poster wasnt twinking? he said " i want to create a
new high elf wizard" even if he isnt twinking his INT will max far before
his STA does

richard cortese

2003-12-18 22:03:40 UTC

stats.

Post by KinSlayer[2040]
you

Post by KinSlayer[2040]
can get to Max int from bazaar sold stuff. i went for max sta and my int
unbuffed is about 340. after all your mana pool wont do crap if your dead
from mob_001's nasty AE

Said by someone who didn't have to level from scratch sans kei when
theres no real newbies to group with anymore.

Post by Ben Sisson
Max int. Worry about high level stamina stuff when you actually get
there. You still have to get through the untwinked lowbie levels and
you'll need mana for that.

He didn't specify, but it could be his first character which would mean
cheap is a relative term. Most low end items like Polished Bone Hoop, Gold
Stud, etcetera still sell for ~50 pp which he won't see until level 10 or
so.

Anyway, the game has changed so much it is harder to make a mistake. Figure
for the first 10 levels, no experience loss. Really, I would almost go for
some cheap AC stuff for a wizard vs. relatively expensive int items
because...

Dying is one of the fastest ways to get hit points and mana<LoH, HT, etc.>
back for levels below 10 now. Just root and burn and if you die, great. Just
memorize root and a burn and you are ready to repeat. Only contest is to
burn all your mana before you die. In my experience, burning mana was easy
to do relative to dying with mana.

There may be some problems getting into a group in PC at level 10. Probably
should make some pp and exp harvesting GLS at this level anyway. Maybe pick
up some guildmaster quest armor. As soon as his level gets good to go for
PC, just mindless and mostly safe leveling to 24ish.

First priority shouldn't be int or stamina for equpment if you can afford
it, it should be focus items or clickies. I mean I would rather have +10 int
+10 stamina +40 mana boots or MQ Journeyman Boots?

KinSlayer[2040]

2003-12-19 09:06:09 UTC

Post by KinSlayer[2040]
Ill disagree here, putting your points into INT isnt the best in the

long

Post by KinSlayer[2040]
run, Reason being that you will max out your INT long before you will

max

Post by KinSlayer[2040]
out your sta as a wizard. Mana pool and HP are the most importent

stats.

Post by KinSlayer[2040]
you

Post by KinSlayer[2040]
can get to Max int from bazaar sold stuff. i went for max sta and my

int

Post by KinSlayer[2040]
unbuffed is about 340. after all your mana pool wont do crap if your

dead

Post by KinSlayer[2040]
from mob_001's nasty AE

Said by someone who didn't have to level from scratch sans kei when
theres no real newbies to group with anymore.

Post by Ben Sisson
Max int. Worry about high level stamina stuff when you actually get
there. You still have to get through the untwinked lowbie levels and
you'll need mana for that.

He didn't specify, but it could be his first character which would mean
cheap is a relative term. Most low end items like Polished Bone Hoop, Gold
Stud, etcetera still sell for ~50 pp which he won't see until level 10 or
so.
Anyway, the game has changed so much it is harder to make a mistake. Figure
for the first 10 levels, no experience loss. Really, I would almost go for
some cheap AC stuff for a wizard vs. relatively expensive int items
because...
Dying is one of the fastest ways to get hit points and mana<LoH, HT, etc.>
back for levels below 10 now. Just root and burn and if you die, great. Just
memorize root and a burn and you are ready to repeat. Only contest is to
burn all your mana before you die. In my experience, burning mana was easy
to do relative to dying with mana.
There may be some problems getting into a group in PC at level 10. Probably
should make some pp and exp harvesting GLS at this level anyway. Maybe pick
up some guildmaster quest armor. As soon as his level gets good to go for
PC, just mindless and mostly safe leveling to 24ish.
First priority shouldn't be int or stamina for equpment if you can afford
it, it should be focus items or clickies. I mean I would rather have +10 int
+10 stamina +40 mana boots or MQ Journeyman Boots?

Jboots and Temp Flux staff >>>>> ALL for wizards

Ringo

2003-12-18 04:02:19 UTC

Post by Jazz

Post by Archerbear

I made my wizard on the INT approach - I put 5 into STA to bring it to

80,

Post by Jazz

Post by Archerbear
and everything else into INT.

Archerbear is right. Go with the INT and pump everything into it that
you are allowed to. Later on in life, your wizard will care about one
thing and one thing only... mana. It's your lifeblood. My sorcerer was
well past the 3K unbuffed mana pool level by the time he was sixty and
whether you are on a raid mob, or just soloing or in a group, there will
be times you want every drop of mana you can squeeze out.
Hit points can be very nice in your first ten to twenty levels before
wizards begin to come into their own, but that passes quickly. Later on
in life, HP aren't going to matter to you. You're not going to be the
one taking a beating from big mobs, and if you are, it will be
mercifully short beating.
Then you go loot your corpse after your rez. ;-)
Go with the mana. This is your mantra.
--
jaZZ

/agree
Int and Str is FAR easier to raise to level caps than Sta. Not only
that get into netted kelp has great stats for survivablity which is
after all more important than having extra manna when you see
...Loading Please Wait

Also if soloing Sta/HP becomes even more important the higher you get
but do what ya want its all good.

xeus

2003-12-18 03:21:37 UTC

you will have easier time leveling up with int around 134 like a gnome or
dark elf has of max int.
put the rest into stamina...
hps are very important at later levels... moreso than mana eventually, as
you are limited by time and nukemana cost and aggro to how much you can use
in a limited time period...
after 7 or 8k mana you realize you can't use it all on a single
monster...maybe quarm or something

truthfully though, stats don't matter except for lower levels, as AA's and
PoP items are there to give you many stats.
and with all the mudflation of items, you won't have trouble with anything
really ...
a long time ago, 5 stamina for me did matter when I was fighting certain
monsters, at like level 8 or something.

xeus
lanys server

b***@dogs-like-spam.com

2003-12-19 19:59:42 UTC

Thanks for the input everyone. I did more messing around with Magelo
and decided that STA just plain doesn't boost wizard hit points enough
to seriously matter. I've decided to go with INT.

Gohrus

2003-12-19 23:33:01 UTC

Post by b***@dogs-like-spam.com
Thanks for the input everyone. I did more messing around with Magelo
and decided that STA just plain doesn't boost wizard hit points enough
to seriously matter. I've decided to go with INT.

And hopefully STR for the other 5 points?

-Gohrus

b***@dogs-like-spam.com

2003-12-20 16:55:08 UTC

Post by Gohrus

And hopefully STR for the other 5 points?

Yes. :) High elf strength is pretty low!

Big Yager

2003-12-22 15:26:42 UTC